What is the true nature of God is terms of Theistic Satanism and Reverse Christian types of Satanism?

1. a) How has God blinded, lied and betrayed us and what is the TRUE nature of God?





b) If these truths were revealed, would more people adopt these beliefs?





2. a) Will Satan betray us?





b) Is Satan able to defeat ';an all-powerful'; God?





Whilst respecting all beliefs and faiths, I am looking for perspectives from the Satanic Community, particularly those of the Theistic belief.What is the true nature of God is terms of Theistic Satanism and Reverse Christian types of Satanism?
I'm a Theistic Satanist so I can answer this right? It seems as though you got a couple of answers up there that were from people that aren't Satanists at all.


1.a) I don't believe that there is a god of which you speak, only followers of a bogus system invented and implemented to gain political control. They have been lying and betraying humanity by telling you of a kind loving god that you can trust. They tell you to give your soul to this deity and after you die you will be rewarded by living out eternity in a wonderful place called Heaven





Now once they have your attention they start telling you that are certain rules that you must abide by, and they introduce a thing called sin. Everything that comes naturally to humans is considered sin, and you're told you must fight your very nature to be pure and good enough for heaven. Because everything in our nature leads us to sin, this way no one can escape.





So they introduce the devil, which is a warped and bastardized form of the real god Satan. They tell people that the things they are naturally inclined to do are simply temptations put there by this devil, and to escape this evil being you must believe in god to be saved, so you can go to heaven.


Now they introduce fear. If you follow the temptations of this devil, there is another special place that god will send you called Hell, where you will be dead forever and never experience love or anything nice ever again. For all eternity.





Now most people bristle at the idea of being threatened and terrified into conformity, which is what the Old Testament did, so they borrowed another story from many other religions about god sending his son, born of a virgin, who died for your sins so you can still be saved. To prove that god really loves you, by killing his own son to save you from yourself.This way if you sin, you can just repent and all is forgiven.





The TRUE nature of this manmade invention was to gain control, period. And by killing off as many people as they could who fought against this outrageous system, they were able to sieze all the land and goods of the heretics. Those who conformed were ';encouraged'; to give to the church, which was the system.


It encouraged self imposed slavery, or death, your choice.





b) if people truly knew about the origins of Xianity I believe at the very least they would rebel, and indeed many are.





2. a) Satan would never betray us. He is the true creator of ALL things, all worlds, all of Nature in her lightest and darkest aspects. He gave us souls and life, and wishes for his creations to flourish and be happy. He imposes no ';rules'; that would be unnatural to us that would only serve to make us unhappy. That is totally illogical and makes no sense.





2. b) Well, there is no god so defeating something that doesn't exist would be a rather pointless concept





Now as for reverse Xian type Satanists....I'm thinking maybe they're just a bit confused. Somehow they've bought into the idea of god and that he's real and so they fight it. They choose to believe in this deity called the devil, and embrace it. Which in all actuality is just embracing Satan. I'm afraid you'd really have to ask them on this one, sorry.





I hope this helps, and as for the above poster named ';Dee';, I have had many conversations with Phoenix and I have followed Hell's Army's answers and I think I can reasonably say that we are all agreed on who Satan actually is. and our belief system has proven to be quite solid. So where he/she gets that we bicker is beyond me. I have yet to see that.What is the true nature of God is terms of Theistic Satanism and Reverse Christian types of Satanism?
First off...#1 a and b forget about them. This ';god'; of which you refer to doesn't exist.


#2 Absolutely not


#2 b does not apply.


Some believe that ';Satan'; was a name given to a much older god. The one that actually did create life. He encompasses ALL THINGS, Xianity plagarized much older religions, forced others to convert or die, then destroyed the evidence of the occult knwledge given to man by Satan, or Lucifer. This knowledge was to help mankind elevate themselves spiritually to the point of being gods themselves.


Reverse Xianity would be this:


';Devil'; worship is usually practiced by fools and posers, A handfull of pissed off Xians who don't know anything except what they've been taught by the bible, and because they don't like god anymore, choose to do the opposite of what the bible says. Real Satanists despise these types of people because they really give us a bad name.


The ';devil'; is a Xian concept, Satan is not.





We teach that we are Natural beings, and as such, should do what comes naturally.


We teach that all the seven deadly sins are falsehoods, as they all lead to mental, emotional, or physical gratification. I could explain this in detail if I have to.


We also teach responsibility, that we are responsible for our own lives.


We teach that animals and children are sacred, as they are Natural in the most complete sense as they have not been sullied by the likes of preconceptions.or interference from humans in an animals case.


We teach to love completely they whom deserve our love,and to hate they who would wish us ill, for then love and hate won't become watered down, by trying to love everyone, even people that do rotten things.


We teach to learn all we can about our natural world, to learn history and symbolism, so that we can better connect to Nature.


We teach an understanding of all the forces of Nature, and how to balance those forces within ourselves.


We show that self-preservation is the highest law, as if you cannot preserve yourself, then how you can preserve anything?


And we show how to ritualize our emotions into magickal workings, to accomplish something that would otherwise be unchangeable, and to rid ourselves of emotions that if held in could destroy us.


We frown upon drug use, as that makes a person less efective as a magician and a human being in general.





Feel free to shoot me an e-mail!





Sorry, I'm in kind of a hurry:)





18 hours later: Dee, I'm Polytheistic and so far Hell's Army and every other Satanist I've met out there pretty much agree on the Nature of Satan. We don't argue at all, and what he has to say is as good as what I may have to say. He's just a little more vocal and aggressive, while I'm a lot more chilled out. I've been at this for 20+ years, so....yeah.
I am not a Satanist of any kind. But I have nothing against theistic Satanism per se, I think it has some good things going for it. It certainly seems to be a more joyful and life-affirming path than biblical Christianity, at least.





I'm a Wiccan who worships the Great Horned God as the ultimate supreme deity; along with his Lady and consort, the Great Goddess of the Moon and stars. Together, They are the very Soul and Spirit of Nature Itself. (The Goddess is the Soul of Nature, the Horned God is the Spirit of Nature. That means that He is the active, fiery, Life Force that sustains the universe. He is the inner fire within all living things, including us. The Goddess is the infinite Sea of Being, the source of all things. She is the serene ocean of bliss that we can also find within us, deep in meditation.)





I have no reason to believe in any kind of Judeo-Christian mythology about Satan, or Yahweh/Jehovah either. I'm a polytheist who believes in many ';lesser gods'; along with the two supreme deities who are the Horned God and the Star Goddess.





So I'm willing to concede that Yahweh/Jehovah might have some kind of metaphysical existence as the ancient tribal deity of the Hebrews/Jews. But he would be a minor deity at most, without much real power. Why in the world would I imagine that he's the creator of the cosmos, or omnipotent, etc.? That makes no sense to me. And in the original Jewish bible, Satan was regarded as Jehovah's assistant, not his enemy. It was not until the Christians came along that Satan was revised into an opponent of the Jewish god. The idea of Jehovah does not appeal to me at all; like many Satanists, I find that idea downright repugnant. So why should I believe in a distorted caricature of a malignant deity that repulses me?





The reason why I believe in the Gods of Wicca is because I have met Them personally, and found Them awesome and beautiful, magical and inspiring. Indeed They were the ones who led me home to my religion. As a Wiccan, I regard my Goddess as the creatrix of the cosmos, because only a feminine deity can give birth. But She could not do that without first being impregnated by the Horned God. I regard the Horned God as more about strength, male virility, power and passion. And I regard the Goddess as more about wisdom, serenity, beauty and love. So I regard the Goddess as omniscient, and I regard the Horned God as omnipotent.





I don't think that anything happens unless the Horned God allows it to happen -- including the spread of Christianity and Islam, two of the most evil, violent, oppressive and bloodthirsty religions on Earth. Why did the Horned God allow that to happen? For several reasons. It might have been necessary for the birth of science, to conceptually remove the Gods from Nature, at least temporarily. Also, the Horned God has a Trickster aspect, so this cosmos is unfolding like a drama or a game, and He loves it all. All the craziness and crisis and drama that we humans have been through, that is what gives rise to the evolutionary impulse within us, the impulse to rise and ascend and become more than we are. From a larger perspective (such as a divine perspective), it's all just part of the drama/comedy/game, and just part of the evolving and unfolding of the cosmos and all its creatures.





I find theistic Satanism quite interesting, and I think it has some very positive things going for it. But I don't understand why anyone who does not worship Yahweh/Jehovah -- and indeed, who thinks that Yahweh is a *bad* portrayal of a deity, which I would agree with -- why would such a person have any reason to imagine that the Judeo-christian mythology is true, or that Jehovah has any real power at all?? Much less imagine that he's the creator, in eternal conflict with Satan, etc.? That makes no sense to me, to buy into the theology and mythology of a religion that you oppose.





That seems to me like an obvious inability to break out of the conceptual box created by the bible religions to trap people in fear. If the Horned God is all about liberation, passion and ecstasy, then wouldn't he want you to just smash that box and walk away from it? That's how I feel, anyway.





I can't imagine wasting my time worrying about Yahweh/Jehovah or Jesus or Allah either. To me all those ideas have no reality to them, they're just silly stories told by the various religions, in order to frighten and control people. If you break free of that, then you leave it behind.





Can't you be a ';theistic Satanist'; and worship ';the Devil'; (or whatever) without putting him into the context of being the boxing partner of the imaginary god Yahweh?





You're just taking the whole Christian ';Battle of the Good vs the Evil'; and buying into it, even if you're rooting for the other team. But that is not the only game in town. Maybe if you connected with the Great Horned God, you would find out that He is a much bigger deity than you imagine, and that the Christian idea of ';the Devil'; is only a pale and distorted reflection of the primal, awesome, supreme Horned God of ancient pagan religions.





I do think that ';Theistic Satanism'; is a positive development in Satanism. The philosophy of atheistic Satanism is mostly a good and healthy thing, and a much-needed counterbalance to all the Christian dogma in the air. But ultimately atheism cannot bring deep joy and fulfillment to the soul. I believe that the ancient pagan Gods (and especially the Horned God) are reaching out to the Theistic Satanists and trying to bring them into the fold of religious pagans. But that is not a very good fit, if they keep hanging onto the bible mythology of Yahweh as the creator deity, etc. It's time to let that go. If you find Yahweh a repugnant deity, then why give him any power at all? He's just a minor pest, at best.





Try breaking out of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic bible-box trap. You might be surprised, excited, and inspired at what you find.





~~~~~~~~~~~~~





ADD: To answer your specific questions:





1.a. The true nature of God is that the Great Horned God is God. He is the male supreme deity. And it's not that He has deliberately deceived us. It's just that we are all spirits evolving in a material universe, and so long as we are not omniscient then of course we will have some illusions about the nature of Reality. The purpose of spiritual evolution is to reveal those Mysteries, and unfold our deepest potential.





1.b. I believe that the deeper spiritual truths or Mysteries are being revealed today, more and more, in many places. You can find spiritual truth in Eastern religions, in the rebirth of many diverse Pagan religions, and even in the New Age movement. Even Christian and Jewish and Muslim mystics who are open-minded and who are willing to understand their scriptures as myth and metaphor instead of literal truth. Gnostic Christians have no love for Jehovah either, you know.





2.a. I don't believe in Satan, but I do believe in the Great Horned God. I feel that He is opposed to the bible religions on principle, because He is the Spirit of Nature, and the bible religions stand opposed to all the things that He loves: Nature, freedom, wildness, sex, passion, ecstasy, intoxication, dance, etc. And He is reaching out to people, trying to awaken them from the stupor brought on by so many centuries of bible religions ruling things, and pushing their noxious dogma in everyone's face. The Horned God is encouraging us to freedom and spiritual breakthrough, seeking to liberate us from our shackles. He will not betray us, because He deeply loves all of life. But He is a Trickster, so we may not always understand the reasons for why He does what He does. He can be very playful and mischievous, a master of magic and illusion.





2.b. The only ';all-powerful god'; is the Great Horned God himself. He has allowed history to unfold the way that it has, because He does not want to control humans as if they were little pieces on a chess board. So He lets people make their own choices, mostly; and often, people can be quite stupid. The bible religions are proof of that, and it is way past time for them to go, and for a beautiful Pagan Renaissance to take place all over the world. I believe that the Gods are helping us in that, but They are not going to do it for us. Mainly it's up to us.





~~~~~~~~





ADD: I disagree with the (atheistic?) Satanist who posted below me, who seems to be disparaging Theistic Satanism and Devil Worship. There are some very insightful and thought-provoking essays, on Diane Vera's website for Theistic Satanism.





She talks about the varieties of Theistic Satanism:


http://www.angelfire.com/ny5/dvera/varie鈥?/a>





And she criticizes those Satanists who put down the ';Devil Worship'; because that is one type of Theistic Satanism:


http://www.angelfire.com/ny5/dvera/bgoat鈥?/a>





It must say something about the nature of human psychology that the Satanists argue with each other over the true nature of Satan, just as much as the Christians argue over the nitpicking details of their imaginary god. Oh well.


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To start off, Jehovah has ';Blinded, lied (to) and betrayed us'; by perverting the public opinion of Satan and Satanism, though Jehovah's followers had a good bit to do with that too.





';The Lord is our Shepherd and we are his Flock';





How does this NOT prove that they're just sheep that do whatever Jehovah tells them?





And yes, if these truths were revealed, many if not most people would see the true beauty and wisdom of the REAL Satanic Belief Systems (and no, I don't mean Devil Worship, as that is actually completely different), however it will take many Aeons to reverse the lies and propaganda that have been spread for millennia, because everyone is too afraid of this ';Fire and Brimstone'; bullsh!t to give Satan, Satanism and Satanists a chance. In the beginnings of Xianity, the Jehovah Worshippers went against thier own code of ';Thou Shalt Not Kill'; and obliterated millions of innocent men, women and children, simply because they didn't agree with the Church.





';Oh that's nice. 'Believe what I say or I'll hurt you.' How VERY Christian of you.';





-Brian Griffin (Family Guy)





With this short of sh!t going on, how can ANYONE see the truth of the situation?





For another thing, as Mankind's first Pagan God, Satanas Luciferi CREATED Humanity. What reason does He have to betray us? Think about it like this: I'm a Musician. If I built a guitar from scratch because I wanted to create something I could love and take great pride and joy in working with, do you really think I'd take that guitar and smash it onstage? When you create something, you don't just go and destroy it on a whim, which if you think about it proved during the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Burning Times, etc, when people were destroying one another because ';God told us to';, that God could not have created Humanity. Father Satan has no reason to betray Humanity, because destroying a group of beings you created out of love is just as counterproductive as smashing a handcrafted, well loved guitar onstage. There's just no sense in it.





In terms of Satan defeating God, I have seen that it's already happened, and God/Jehovah was not all powerful either. If Jehovah was really all powerful, being the immature little child he was in the Old Testament, where he threw countless temper tantrums because people weren't doing his will, people like me would surely be either dead or Catatonic by now. Satanism has grown immensely in the past Decade alone, and continues to grow. If Jehovah were all powerful, or had any amount of real control over us at all beyond fear and guilt tactics, this would have been impossible.





So to answer your question from earlier, the TRUE Nature of God is the nature of a jealous old man who can't stand the way his neighbohr raises his own children, so whenever he can, he sneaks over to his neighbohrs house and tells the children, ';He's not your REAL Father! He's a monster! Do you really want to be raised by a monster!?'; and begins teaching them that no way but his is correct, and that they should kill anyone who doesn't agree, even though they know it's wrong.





They can go on and on about how we're ';Evil'; and how we ';Kill people in our Rituals';, but they confuse us with Devil Worshippers. The Devil is a Fictional Xian Character intended to scare people. Satan Lucifer is a Pagan God, and therefore FAR pre-dates Xianity. In my MANY months as a Traditional Satanist, in which I have met many others like me, interacted and done much with said others, and had quite the list of experiences, I've never met a True Satanist who fits the Devil Worshipper Stereotypes. They don't harm anyone who has not done them or someone they love harm, and I certainly don't either, so I say the Church of God can stick that in their Crackpipe and smoke it. Here's how I look at it: Who are you going to trust about the nature of a group of beings (in Satanas and His Demons and Demonesses)? Are you going to trust those beings themselves and those who have loved, admired, respected and honored them since the Dawn of Mankind? Or, are you going to trust the guys who came around a couple Aeons later, started spreading fear, guilt and propaganda, and killed anyone that disagreed with their filth? You do the math. Also, we're not JUST ';Reverse Xians';. We may believe in Anti-Xianity, but we had a complete Pagan Belief System going long before Xianity ever surfaced on the Religion Scene, so that would make it impossible for Anti-Xianity to be all there is to it. As far as Reverse-Xianity, I don't subscribe to all that ';Lord's Prayer in Reverse'; sh!t. To quote a Great Satanic Writer of the Aeon of Lucifer:





';You can paint a White Cat Black, but it's STILL a Cat';.





I don't say the Lord's Prayer in any order, I prefer to use what's commonly referred to as the Satanic Our Father (AKA the Original, Pagan Version that was ripped off from us among many other things). I find that's a lot more respectful and productive than just Reverse-Xian Prayers.





However long it took me in my former life of Spiritual Slavery and being taught lies and unwisdom (I was raised Catholic), I realized that Father Satan is the better of the two deities in question, and that He's far from their foolish Xian ';Devil';. I believe eventually Humanity in general will realize this as well. Those who don't are free not to, it's thier choice. However, they'll only ever be too afraid to know what they're missing, and are of little consequence to Father Satan, to His Demons, and to people like myself.





*Dennis H - Hey, F*cktard, ever stop and wonder why you have exactly 0% Best Answer? When will you people realize that ';Sin'; is not wrong? Sin is a natural Human reaction to a given stimulus. When we're aroused, we get sexual (Lust). When we're harmed, we get angry, and we seek justice (Wrath), when we feel we've earned it, we eat a big, hearty meal full of tasty foods, and then sit back and enjoy the feeling of a full stomach (Gluttony), when we've done something good or show ourselves to be good people, we feel good about ourselves (Pride). What's wrong with all that? That's right, nothing, so your point is debunked. The Church just likes us to believe that Sin makes us guilty so we'll feel bad about ourselves and keep Praying, Paying and Slaying for their cause, and as little as people like you can admit it, people started to understand the nature of their manipulation a long time ago. Also, Satanas doesn't ';Tempt'; us to Sin, He has better things to do. His teachings include being who we are, and that includes Sin, as Sin is natural to humanity. That's not ';tempting';, that's teaching. Get it straight and pipe down if you don't have anything better to do than make fun of Mankind's Creator. Also, didn't the Asker of this question state that he was looking for the opinions of Theistic Satanists? You might want to learn to read properly if you intend to bring that 0% up. Take a Holy Hike, Jehovah Worshipper.





Ave Satanas!!!





-Valkyri
I am researching thiestic satanism as a alternative to wicca, and these answers and links have really helped. thank you all for these answers...even though i didnt ask this question.





thanks for askin this question dude, you rock!!





if you think alternatively...ADD Me as a contact!!
SATANIS.LUCIFER IS REAL!!!! HE IS THE TRUE CREATOR OF THIS WORLD!!!! JEHOVA AND CHRISTINAITY IS FAKE!!! I AM A TRADITIONAL SATANIST, AND IM HERE TO ARGUE WITH ANYONE WHO WANTS TO. SATAN IS NOT EVIL!! AND SATANISM IS NOT EVIL!! HAIL SATAN
Satan lost when Jesus Christ died. Satan has no real power over us, he can only tempt us to sin. And we will sin, since we are sinners. Yet my sins have been forgiven. So I sit back and laugh at Satan(ists). Boy, you have the atheists wrapped around your fingers though.